Alpine Snowboard Plate Systems

[SunSurfer]

Hi,

Was 4mm carbon plate pretty bendy or stiff?

Stiffer than any plate I had managed to build. BV had built me an NSR 182 symmetric which I mounted the Boiler on.
Quite a different feel from anything I'd ridden before, but have been free riding the combo for the last 2 days and getting my body recalibrated to the NSR/Boiler characteristics. Enjoying the edge hold it has and getting lower than ever before! Minimal problems at low speed, lift lines etc once I got the feel of it. Can hockey stop it, and skid the tail happily now. Rode it today in 5-6 inches of new powder (Snowmass) - sat back on the tail and surfed it without problems.
Bruce told me a cautionary tale when I picked it up, so I've been taking things gradually. Tomorrow at Buttermilk, with fresh groom and good light, we'll let her run a little.



Photos in the New Board Porn once I get home and can upload stuff properly. Having problems even sending e-mail via the hotel internet link.

SunSurfer

[lowrider]

How do conditions compare to Craigieburn? I would imagine heat in your room is a bonus ! Enjoy that new board.

[stewart Hodgins]

Stewart is that your plate that went missing after Bruce left??

Yep, thats the Magical Coiler plate in all its glory. It has a new home now as it's being replaced with a new sexy version soon to come.

Stewart

[corey_dyck]

I spent Friday of SES riding the Donek and the Bomber 4mm plates on my board to reduce variables.

Pros on the side of the Bomber plate:
1. Lower stack height was awesome! Very noticeable, especially in the lift line.
2. More damp feeling. I don't have enough experience to know how this works or what this means, but it was nice.
3. The hardware is beautiful. Typical Bomber style, it's finished to a high degree and very well thought out.

Pros of the Donek plate:
1. Less influence on the board's torsional stiffness. It was easier to skid at low speeds.
2. Lower cost

I debated long and hard to tell if I liked the BP sufficiently to pay the extra cost premium. I decided to wait a while and think it over, after all these plates are nice but not necessary (that's what I thought at the time). I took the plate off my board and headed up for one more run. What an eye-opener that was on a lightly-chopped up run! I had decided that I needed a plate. I went with the Donek plate, mainly due to the lower cost. Riding with it on Saturday was great as I couldn't find smooth groomers anywhere. I'm a believer. I've got three boards and only one plate, so it's likely I'll add a Bomber plate in the near future... The BP lowers are awesome too as they greatly reduce stack height.

Interestingly, both plates make noise. The Donek plate sounds like angry squirrels are chasing me on heelsides, the Bomber plate sounds like I have a piece of Tupperware loosely fastened on my board. LOL! This didn't factor into my decision at all, but it's mildly entertaining.

Off-topic note: The new BP lowers have an unexpected feature with 6/6 cants - you can rotate the center disc by pushing it up when off the board. I run nearly pure toe & heel lift, this allows me to change my binding angles when swapping between a narrower and wider board without undoing all the binding screws. With my size 27 UPZ boots I would have to R&R 22 screws to swap bindings to a board of different width, conveniently I only need to pull the 8 mounting screws to do this with the BP lowers. I'm lucky that I run close to 5 degrees difference between the boards so it's close enough to just rotate the disc.

[corey_dyck]

I rode my NSR with the Donek plate most of Saturday and Sunday, then pulled it and rode without. It really felt like I had tons of boot underhang - it was notably harder to tip up on edge than with the plate. You get used to the change quickly but it was extremely obvious in the first few turns.

I'm still on the fence for riding on good snow, riding the board 'naked' feels like I have more authority to change what the board is doing and I get more feedback. It feels more 'playful'. Has anyone else noticed this? Admittedly, I still need to experiment more with axle positioning. I definitely want a plate once the snow gets chopped up, it's lots less work to rail a board with a plate in those conditions.

I also need to get on some hard ice as Fin mentioned that the East Coast gang loves plates in those conditions. Unfortunately, that'll be pretty soon as the weather is unseasonably warm here.

[Boarder_Ted]

I'm still on the fence for riding on good snow, riding the board 'naked' feels like I have more authority to change what the board is doing and I get more feedback. It feels more 'playful'. Has anyone else noticed this? Admittedly, I still need to experiment more with axle positioning. I definitely want a plate once the snow gets chopped up, it's lots less work to rail a board with a plate in those conditions.

I also need to get on some hard ice as Fin mentioned that the East Coast gang loves plates in those conditions. Unfortunately, that'll be pretty soon as the weather is unseasonably warm here.

I will certainly second the whole less playful thing. It was one of the things that turned me off about a plate. It took a fun, lively board and made it damp and less fun for me. I had taken it off altogether until I made some flex modifications to it and watched a great video on mounting positions and the effect they have. I like it much better now. Especially the softer flex.

And I live on the east coast, Maine in fact, and we have our share of firm snow. I find that it holds on ice...until it doesn't and then it lets go with little warning. Personally I would rather be riding without a plate on good snow or ice. Now in crud is where the plate really shines. It does indeed make for a smoother ride.

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

Off-topic note: The new BP lowers have an unexpected feature with 6/6 cants - you can rotate the center disc by pushing it up when off the board

Photos and or explain in slightly different terms. I don't quite understand?? Thanks in advance.

[BlueB]

I rode my NSR with the Donek plate most of Saturday and Sunday, then pulled it and rode without. It really felt like I had tons of boot underhang - it was notably harder to tip up on edge than with the plate. You get used to the change quickly but it was extremely obvious in the first few turns.

I'm still on the fence for riding on good snow, riding the board 'naked' feels like I have more authority to change what the board is doing and I get more feedback. It feels more 'playful'. Has anyone else noticed this? Admittedly, I still need to experiment more with axle positioning. I definitely want a plate once the snow gets chopped up, it's lots less work to rail a board with a plate in those conditions.

I also need to get on some hard ice as Fin mentioned that the East Coast gang loves plates in those conditions. Unfortunately, that'll be pretty soon as the weather is unseasonably warm here.

I 2nd most of this. Definitelly less playfull and more railed-in feeling. It does hold better on hard snow.
The one part where I differ, is getting the board on the edge. I feel it's easier to get plateless board on the edge, especially if you are in a "lazy mode" and just cruze around below the 45* edge angles. The plate starts to work properly for me only at about that angle of inclination. No "lazy" riding with the plate.

Other day I was shocked that platless soft Kessler felt way bouncier then a stiff plated Coiler, on somewhat irregullar hardpack. However, with plate I had to go full blast, to get the advantage of it.

[lowrider]

I had the opportunity to observe two riders each on a new metal Coiler one with a plate the other without, what a difference! I'm sure everyone by now realises how damp a metal board is compared to a glass board but i had no idea that a metal board could be further dampened to the extent it was, just by toping it off with a plate. I have stated before that a glass board with a plate is almost as good as a metal board but a metal board with a plate unbelievable until you experience it. Now a metal board with a matching plate designed by a board builder (unobtanium ?) i hope not.

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

Now a metal board with a matching plate designed by a board builder (unobtanium ?) i hope not.

Several years ago. Metal board, metal plate, custom board system built by one builder. Done that. Works good

[corey_dyck]

Photos and or explain in slightly different terms. I don't quite understand?? Thanks in advance.

Take bindings off the board, push the center disc up and rotate it within the binding. Rotate to desired angle, then wiggle back down and remount to board. Think of it like changing the angle on an F2 binding, not like a TD2/3. I can try taking a video if that's still confusing.

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

Now I understand.

Yes, that is handy. Although I seldom change my angles. Can you just leave the bolts loose? Lift up in the "Finger Holes" of the center disk and turn the bindings? Probably the same amount of effort.

[pogokoenig]

I 2nd most of this. Definitelly less playfull and more railed-in feeling. It does hold better on hard snow.
The one part where I differ, is getting the board on the edge.

Me 2.
I made the experience that plates can be fun when you have lots of space. You can just rail Mach 3 and switch off your brain. Once it gets narrower I felt that I needed to step on the brake and interrupt my run. The speed feeling is just awesome but it almost felt a bit scary in some situations. The handling of the board gets more difficult.

You might also feel a better edge hold. On my opinion modern boards do not have issues with edge hold at all - regardless if glass or metal. Thus, the extra edge hold is more a "good to know, that you have it in case you need it".

Because of the extra comfort the plate delivers I tend to say that it might form bad habits. Riding a plate and working on riding technique at the same time can be tricky.

[Hans]

I rode my NSR with the Donek plate most of Saturday and Sunday, then pulled it and rode without. It really felt like I had tons of boot underhang - it was notably harder to tip up on edge than with the plate. You get used to the change quickly but it was extremely obvious in the first few turns.

I'm still on the fence for riding on good snow, riding the board 'naked' feels like I have more authority to change what the board is doing and I get more feedback. It feels more 'playful'. Has anyone else noticed this? Admittedly, I still need to experiment more with axle positioning. I definitely want a plate once the snow gets chopped up, it's lots less work to rail a board with a plate in those conditions.

I also need to get on some hard ice as Fin mentioned that the East Coast gang loves plates in those conditions. Unfortunately, that'll be pretty soon as the weather is unseasonably warm here.

I have ridden my BBP Mathilda 4 mm for the first time on my Coiler 168 VSR last week on hardpack in the morning and slushy warm mixed condtions in the afternoon. On hardpack I experienced an endless edgehold and comfort but was a little unsure of the endless speed you can get out of this setup when you make the turns longer. It looks like the speed has no end to it, it builds and it builds and builds up speed endlessly. I have to run more days with this setup to get used to the (high) speeds. The carves are more easy and more sure to made, espcially in and through piles of snow. Definately an energy and knee saver. You can feel the bumps but they are almost soaked up by 95%. The turns weren't as small as I could get out of the board without the plate. I just experienced two times that the board couldn't handle the pressure when I wanted to make the turns smaller. But may be it was just my technique? In the mixed conditions in the afternoon I felt more secure on the board than without the plate. The board/plate setup handled the conditions very well, even in slush. I could even ride the plate at slow somewhat lazy cruisin'speeds no probs: have to make the turns smarter/sometimes uphill. You have to stay more focused though. Just because of the less experience riding a plate I think.

Conclusion:
Plus: endless edgehold and secure feeling in turns.
Minus: scary endspeed I have to get used to it. No piece of equipment for beginners. The feel of the slope you have with a normal board isn't there: is also a benefit because you have more comfort and control. The board is less 'playful' with a plate.

So, board/plate setup: for boarders who seeks more comfort, energy- and kneesaver. With the proper technique it's a welcome versatality in alpinesnowboarding/freecarving. I still like my playful Virus boards!

[guido591]

On the left is a Virus UFC 173 Carbon with an MK Plate from Slovenia.
At right is an Apex Fast + 186 GS with Apex Board on Board Plate.

Both have exceeded my expectations.

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

On the left is a Virus UFC 173 Carbon with an MK Plate from Slovenia.
At right is an Apex Fast + 186 GS with Apex Board on Board Plate.

Both have exceeded my expectations.

Thant is some very nice looking hardware!!

[Mike T]

I'm still on the fence for riding on good snow, riding the board 'naked' feels like I have more authority to change what the board is doing and I get more feedback. It feels more 'playful'. Has anyone else noticed this? Admittedly, I still need to experiment more with axle positioning. I definitely want a plate once the snow gets chopped up, it's lots less work to rail a board with a plate in those conditions.

I also need to get on some hard ice as Fin mentioned that the East Coast gang loves plates in those conditions. Unfortunately, that'll be pretty soon as the weather is unseasonably warm here.

I definitely notice that a plate reduces playfulness, and I too prefer naked boards on good snow. I find that on ice (or close to ice) the plate increases grippiness, but also increases speed, and depending on where I'm riding, I might choose to use the plate, or not.

[corey_dyck]

The Donek plate saved a day that had me thinking about going home early. I was greeted with crummy grooming with big ridges that froze into boilerplate ice overnight. I explored and hated everything I found. Threw the plate on my favorite Coiler 167 board and I could carve WAY easier through stuff. Nice!

It does make the board turn bigger turns than without, but the benefits far outweighed that drawback.

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

Picked up a few recently. As always Fin's work is amazing!!! I need to make some changes to a BP to fit on a board I like with Snow Stix. I am also likely to do some modds to soften it. I have heard that others have done the same. Anyone care to share photos and ideas. We all understand that these modifications are NOT approved by Bomber Industries and you do so at your own risk.

Bryan

[SunSurfer]

Picked up a few recently. As always Fin's work is amazing!!! I need to make some changes to a BP to fit on a board I like with Snow Stix. I am also likely to do some modds to soften it. I have heard that others have done the same. Anyone care to share photos and ideas. We all understand that these modifications are NOT approved by Bomber Industries and you do so at your own risk.

Bryan

A good topic for a separate thread.

SunSurfer

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

A good topic for a separate thread.

SunSurfer

Considered it. http://www.bomberonline.com/VBulleti...445#post376445

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

Tinkler Top Plate accepts both the Tinkler bar system or the BOL Boiler Plate , This one is mounted UPM. However it can of course be used with the 4 x 4 hardware also. Nice!!

Order your custom flex Tinker Top Plate now!!! Choose your shape, top sheet material, color, flex. Adjustable!!

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

Modded BP plate for my Tinkler "Aris" TNT with snow stix. 4x4 mounting.

[pokkis]

Here Tinkler plate on Apex SL with my own silly mechanics

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

I was all set to give these two set-ups a go today, The last week day day of the winter season at MHM. Didn't happen.

On the left is my current favorite Tinkler TNT 185cm with a modded BP 5mm BP plate.
On the right the "Headhunter 200cm" with a modded Tinkler plate on BP hardware.

[scrutton]

New stuff being tested by Donek.

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

Sean Martin (Donek) and Todd Brown came out west to do additional testing on Donek's latest plate systems. Here is a video of Sean and Todd on the mountain!!!

Additional thread on the results of testing.

PS. Yes, late season at Mt Hood can be excellent. Check it out, no crowds, deep snow, cheap passes. As of June1, the camps start and it gets very busy.

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

The VB Forum search function is still pretty limited since the upgrade. For those looking for an easy way to search the site for my information about plate systems.

Bomber/Google Plate Systems search link.

https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&...pe=&as_rights=


Or simply go to Google Search and paste these terms > plate systems site:bomberonline.com


Just for fun. In running the search I found this post from over eight years ago. Tinkler plate for 250!! I wish!!!

http://www.bomberonline.com/VBulleti...lates-for-sale

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

Bomber Boiler Plate "Lite" version.

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

"Look Ma No binding plate"

I like the idea. I remember first seeing this on a system Jacoby showed me made from Derby Flex mounts.
Mine will be a solid plate. Shim stock is very handy!!!