Small SCR Carving

[NoirX252]

My sidecut is around 7.95m on a softboot board, this is too small to lay down, correct? I've been having trouble carving/keeping my speed down on steep ice, any suggestions?

1. I'm afraid to crank it real high due to boot/binding out even with risers as the board bends too much.

2. The board quickly gets up to too high of a speed to carve a pure turn I think on a moderately steep pitch, especially if it's icy for the sidecut

[NickG]

I think a lot of it actually comes down to how sharp your edges are and how much overhang you have. I know exactly the problem you are having - I was on the mountain yesterday and I kept washing out on the softboot setup. I gave up b/c I like my back foot at 0* for doing jumps/etc, but I might have been able to solve the problem if I had eliminated my overhang with steeper angles.

My friend just got a new board and his edges are very sharp, whereas mine were not. I felt like it was a little easier for him to stick carves on the ice, other variables aside.

In terms of "laying down" do you mean like an EC carve or just really hard carves? I don't think I could EC on ice with the soft setup, and it would be very hard to do for me on the hard setup, but not impossible.

I crank my burton T6 (softie) pretty hard when I get the chance. I wouldn't worry about the board bending too much.

In terms of speed control, it's kind of hard to explain, but here is what I do on a slalom board:

1) go hard into your carve, ie - good body angle, proper edge pressure, "really want it"
2) hold the carve for just a second longer than you normally would
3) your circles shouldn't look like C's and S's going down, they just come up the hill a little bit, I guess you could say like G's or the bottom of J's.
4) the "coming up the hill" part is what controls your speed.
5) after you come up the hill a little bit, THEN you flip your edge and start the next turn.


If you do it right, you can slow down so much that you need to start doing C's again to pick up speed.

I hope that makes sense.

Paint picture below for the win:

[carboncarver]

Hee, hee...I love short radius carving, it is mostly what I focus on. The 7-10 meter SCR are sooo much fun to play with. First off, as mentioned above, SHARP edges, including the nose contact points(the nose will be catchy, but it starts a carved turn much better). Second, know your max lean angle that you can achieve with your equipment and conditions. If it is 30degrees of angle to the snow before bootout, then that is as far as you practice leaning. If you can adjust your bindings to get your heels/toes at but not over the edge and pull 45 or even 60 degrees, your board's SCR will really start working for you. Once you figure out the mechanical limits of your gear and snow, you can start drawing lines like Nick has shown to feel out how much body angle you can lay out, relative to the board's speed and angle to the snow.
I learned from some softbooters long ago, that you can lay out as deep a carve as you want, if you can make up the difference between board angle(ie 30 degrees) and body angle (maybe 60 degrees) using strength, leverage and balance(or, just deeply bent knees).


A trick to practice is: Toilet turns, or T-turns for polite reference

In a clear space where there can be no collisions or other stupid accidents due to your intense focus and someone else's lack of observance...

-assuming that we have some smooth snow of solid consistency(you referred to this as Ice)

-With your freshly sharpened edges and carefully set bindings,

-Strap in and bend your knees(and Hiney) until your femurs(thighs) are PARALLEL with the snow and your body is angled somewhat upright, but balanced(*like you are perched on the toilet*) with weight centered between your feet.

-your Hiney should still be 12-18" off the snow and not sitting on your heels

-Point board into the fall line and start coasting flatbase

- when you have enough speed to hold a "carve", lean your knees (or your hiney) toward the snow, set the board at maximum lean angle and just balance yourself on the edge until the board carves back up the hill and you stop(an official J-turn).

-repeat this step on both edges, until you can positively feel the edge set, and you can BALANCE at the max lean angle(not at boot out, just before) for the duration of the turn

-Once you have felt the edge bite and get some decent balance with the one way carves, you will notice there is some acceleration and G-force as the board hooks up the turn. Get used to this feeling, it is the feeling you are trying to achieve: speed, high angles and G-force

-When you are confident with your first Toilet turns, it is time to link them together

-Start a carve as above, as you turn across the hill, stand up out of the turn and finish the turn at 90 degrees to the fall line(a C-turn, like in Nick's discription above), basically shooting across the hill, then drop back down in to the T-Turn position and initiate the next turn down into the fall line.

If you are carrying too much speed at this point, scrub it off with a little skid and then drop back into the Toilet turn position and lean into the next carve.

As you develop some muscle tone in your legs, you will be able to link more and more turns together.

You will also start to find coordination for fore and aft weighting to squirt out of the turns. Start the turn with weight on front foot and finish with weight on back foot. Remember to re-weight the front foot for the next turn or you will be in the back seat too far.

nuff fer now, film and post the results on Youtube then link it here for us to congratulate you on your progress.:lurk:

edit for nonsense

[NoirX252]

Going to try a variety of stuff this Sunday.

Been playing around with my stance angles/width/palmer plates.

How many degrees would you say a board is tilted up during a laid turn?

I have no issues with toe side, I have an issue with heel side due to the bindings hitting first, I've tried ~ 54/48? I lose a lot of leverage but I have ZERO overhang and can lay my ass down sometimes heel side.

I don't think a board every really gets up to 90? not sure, trying to get the lowest binding angles these palmer riser plates will let me get for more leverage

[carboncarver]

So, how was practice? I don't recommend angling soft bindings past about 30-35 degrees. The support of the highback is helpful for holding the edge on a heel side. Did I forget to mention forward lean adjustment on your binding high backs? You will want some forward lean to make the heel side board lean angles easier to work.

If you ask the board to lean to 90 degrees, it will.
162 carbon Dual-e at about >that< many degrees:
http://i306.photobucket.com/albums/nn241/snowhawkjockey/snowboarding/hobiecarve.jpg

[NoirX252]

Don't think that's 90 :P

Was able to carve on hard compressed chalk, some areas were icy, and when it was icy, it was always steep, I would say (I realized from another threat a 45 degree slope is actually quite steep and is a rarity among smaller resorts, most people greatly overestimate gradients)

I would say it was then uh, 35? On less steep areas I was able to hold a carve. On shorter steeper sections I was able to hold a carve too (not quite as steep as the "35" one, I think)

Was laying it down toeside as usual, heel side I can't quite get my butt to rub the snow, even with risers i was booting + binding out on 30/21 on size 9 boots on a 24.6cm board (or 24.x cm, blah), sooo I changed the angles to 48/42, much better and was able to lay it down.

Going to have to find a compromise, my heel side turns are a bit compromised when it comes to freeriding.

I would say from my carving, My strong dominant turn has shifted from toe, to heel, and now toe, I frequently do tight 270 degree turns at the base toeside to stop.

I feel with lower angles, angulation on heel side is compromised, but I get much more leverage for edge pressure.

My bindings suck for steep angles and gilmour bias I think.

(My feet are smaller than a size 9, I think i am slightly heel biased on both feet with the bindings set to size 9 position, which is the most forward it can go)...

So yeah...

I hope my alpine board gets here soon!