Can U Break An Ankle In Hard Boots ?

[SteveInOregon]

I only ask because I think I did today at Shasta.:(

I was just cruzing not doing anything, I was coming up on some Newb's, I did a typical lazy heel slide to slow down from about 15 mph to about 10 or less, the nose hooked a ski rut and slammed to a jerking stop , my lead foot also jammed to an abrupt stop the board and all jerked sideways and down I went in real pain.

I felt a crunch in my ankle kind of like jumping off a high ladder into the pavement strait into the feet with the ankle being the weak link.

I was in immediate real pain, I got my boot off ( no small feat ) writhed around in agony in 3ft off piste for a minuet then packed it down into the snow and sat there and tried to "look casual" ( I didn't work ) :freak3:

I tried to get up and put weight on it NO WAY feelt like the worst sprain I have ever had or a fracture ?????? :confused:

I had to take the Red + slide ride out to the "break & snap shack", lol.

So that's not a big deal, I'm already home a couple beers down, a pump up splint boot I picked up at a thrift store on the way back, a Tylenol-Codine and I'm ok, "BUT" what the hell gives , can you really break an ankle in a good fitting hard boot with no lateral bending :eek:. ??????


I thought I had all the bases covered, and one of them was hard boots :cool:


Anyone experience a jammed, severe sprain or fracture wearing H-boots ?

[boarderboy]

Haven't done it but have seen it...

BB

[Jonny]

Heck yes - in fact you can break an ankle in stiff racing ski boots. Hope yours is OK.

[Loc]

I did 2 seasons ago. Not cool. I wish you a speed recovery!

[Dave ESPI]

I bet Fibula. Get an Xray. Best way to know for sure.
My GF is 7 weeks out from one, a plate and 2 screws later, she is OK.
Hope for the best, atleast it isn't "serious" as an injury.

[SteveInOregon]

I did 2 seasons ago. Not cool. I wish you a speed recovery!
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MY REPLY: You broke Your ankle in hard boots !!!!!!!!! * sigh.

You guys also say you have seen it happen, ohhhh geeeez, oh well, thanks for answering my question.

Just before I did this trick, I was just a little tired and sore from chasing a looser with a laser on Thurs night, then 5 hours of riding Shasta today, I was being Mr Nice guy, not bombing the run and DAM, of all the things to happen, lol.

By hook or crook I will "hobble" out to Bachelor for my 1st OES in ealry march.

I am so000000 jones'ing to see a gang of real carvers, ride real groom ( not the death ride-ice ruts I always ride ), "and" take a private carving -coaching lesson.

Do you guys know how bad I got it >>>> my p.c desk top is the trail map of Bachelor, that is how much I am want to be a OES.

Thanks again answering my question, Im starting to smile again my 2nd T with Codine is kickin in , lol .:):p

[SteveInOregon]

I bet Fibula. Get an Xray. Best way to know for sure.
My GF is 7 weeks out from one, a plate and 2 screws later, she is OK.
Hope for the best, atleast it isn't "serious" as an injury.
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I'm sorry to hear that man, pins & screws can be devastating.



As for me, So I don't think this is "serious", I know for sure its not a Tib or Fib , its down in the articulating joint area.

Again , sorry to hear she is gonna always set off metal detectors.

[tahoetrencher]

A tib/fib can spiral down into the ankle knob. Count on it.
I've done it twice. In hard boots.

[Mike T]

Severe sprain - check. Broke my boot shell while I was at it. I thought for sure I had broken it at the time, it hurt like hell.

[crucible]

Ohhhhhh, Yeah....

Don't ask me how I know...

Geo

[SteveInOregon]

A tib/fib can spiral down into the ankle knob. Count on it.
I've done it twice. In hard boots.
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My REPLY: >>>> "DAM" <<<<<<

A few questions;

1) Was it the same ankle> twice ?

2) Were you in a hard cast, and how long ?

3) How long till you could boot up again ?

Thank You

[Chucklebeast]

If you got the coverage, check it...if not, keep off it, ice it for the 1st 48/72hours and then soak it in a healing bath of Epsom salts. That will draw out the bruising and hopefully that is all it is. I watched my calf bend around a tree the wrong way, and was sure it was broke off at the boot-top, but after a month of rehab, and watching my leg turn every color under the rainbow, I was able to walk again, and rode later that year, and I'm sure I broke something, I just didn't have the scratch to see the pro's...it was nearly 2 years before I got on the hard-boots again though, but that was by choice...

So get healed, and keep the alcohol intake down, as it promotes swelling and reduces the body's ability to heal...and maybe I'll see you at Bach, when is it?

[Steve Prokopiw]

Severe sprain - check. Broke my boot shell while I was at it. I thought for sure I had broken it at the time, it hurt like hell.

In 1991 at Copper. Nearly turned my foot all the way around in a Flexon Comp.Broke the cuff right down the back seam.Pain was enough to make me throw up right there under the lift:0

[emorris]

In hard boots. Un hooked the rear binding because it hurt like crazy. Then I treid to step in again but it hurt too much. It turned out to be a broken medial malleolus, the inside of the ankle.

I am in a hard cast and it comes off on March 2nd. The doc said two weeks of PT. It has pretty much stopped hurting.

The first couple of days to a week it really helped to keep it up as high as possible to stop the swelling. If its broken, caffeine and nicotine slow healing by constricting blood vessels.

I was told to take 800 mg of Ibuprofen every 6 hours to reduce swelling.

If you can you should get it looked at.

How is it feeling now?

Also look at this thread:

http://www.bomberonline.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=6311

Feel better!

[Steve Prokopiw]

and cigs at the same time? Bummer:) Hope it heals well otherwise.

[emorris]

I figured that the stress from a complete cold turkey withdrawal might do harm (if not to me, then to those around me!)

Hoping to be back on a board in three weeks. I have two new (to me) boards since the break!

[tahoetrencher]

1) one of each

2)hard cast for 6-8 weeks is all

3)Both end of the season deals but I was crutchless in a coupla months, 80% in 3-4 months and all better in maybe 8. Honestly a spiral heals stronger than before the break. My first break I was in my late 20's and I bounced right back.
The second time in my late 30's left me with a little loss of motion in the ankle, be sure to do the PT!

[SteveInOregon]

If you got the coverage, check it...if not, keep off it, ice it for the 1st 48/72hours and then soak it in a healing bath of Epsom salts. That will draw out the bruising and hopefully that is all it is. I watched my calf bend around a tree the wrong way, and was sure it was broke off at the boot-top, but after a month of rehab, and watching my leg turn every color under the rainbow, I was able to walk again, and rode later that year, and I'm sure I broke something, I just didn't have the scratch to see the pro's...it was nearly 2 years before I got on the hard-boots again though, but that was by choice...

So get healed, and keep the alcohol intake down, as it promotes swelling and reduces the body's ability to heal...and maybe I'll see you at Bach, when is it?
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MY REPLY: Ok, I will ice it for 72hrs, I have had it almost frozen since 2pm.

I am going to Bach regardless, I will be a camera man for anyone who wants to be on Youtube if nothing else.;)

I will take Your advice and stop the beer, well how about a 1 week hiatus because my Douoble IPA home brew will be ready to de-cap and taste by then :biggthump

[emorris]

At least until you stop taking anything with Codine! Not too good with large doses of Ibuprofen either.

[SteveInOregon]

In hard boots. Un hooked the rear binding because it hurt like crazy. Then I treid to step in again but it hurt too much. It turned out to be a broken medial malleolus, the inside of the ankle.

I am in a hard cast and it comes off on March 2nd. The doc said two weeks of PT. It has pretty much stopped hurting.

The first couple of days to a week it really helped to keep it up as high as possible to stop the swelling. If its broken, caffeine and nicotine slow healing by constricting blood vessels.

I was told to take 800 mg of Ibuprofen every 6 hours to reduce swelling.

If you can you should get it looked at.

How is it feeling now?

Also look at this thread:

http://www.bomberonline.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=6311

Feel better!
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MY REPLY: Thank You too for the real life advice, so You and I are now left to only riding the "message" boards too , lol ;).

I don't smoke and I'm not much for coffee ( unless it's Kona or Kauai pea berry, ground 1 cup @ a time ) and I cant afford that very often.

See StarBucks reaction > :barf:

No can do on the Ibuprofen because I literally eat a hole in my stomach last year from dealing with my "lady friends" female illogical retorts and mood based mind games ( See pissed off un-happy face > :argue: = Steve>:mad: lol. ( no dis on the ladies here ) this was "my" problem by not dealing with her with patients and firm understanding, so I gave myself an ulcer ( way to go Steve , thank me thank me very much , lol )

I feel fine so long as I don't move, lol, I know that doesn't say much but there was zero swelling, I mean none at all, so I hope I am just a sissy with a sprain , I will take that over a tuff guy with a fracture any day , lol.

[SteveInOregon]

In 1991 at Copper. Nearly turned my foot all the way around in a Flexon Comp.Broke the cuff right down the back seam.Pain was enough to make me throw up right there under the lift:0
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MY REPLY: "Flexon Comp" what is that, if that ain't a binding then its a torture technique or an Olympic ski jump trick . lol .

I'm good at not puking "unless" I am on a diesel fishing boat , what with exhaust fumes , the constant engine vibration, the rolling swell, the smell of bacon from the galley, cheep cigars, & rotting fish>>>
.>>>:barf:

[SteveInOregon]

1) one of each

2)hard cast for 6-8 weeks is all

3)Both end of the season deals but I was crutchless in a coupla months, 80% in 3-4 months and all better in maybe 8. Honestly a spiral heals stronger than before the break. My first break I was in my late 20's and I bounced right back.
The second time in my late 30's left me with a little loss of motion in the ankle, be sure to do the PT!
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I will be sure to ask you about PT when I can gimp around, thank You for the reply to my questions.;)

[emorris]

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I hope I am just a sissy with a sprain

That is exactly what I was thinking on the sled ride down to the ski patrol hut!

I hope that's all you have! This cast really sucks! Really inconvenient.

[SteveInOregon]

That is exactly what I was thinking on the sled ride down to the ski patrol hut!

I hope that's all you have! This cast really sucks! Really inconvenient.add
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MY REPLY: That's a nice family You got there, Momma board, Daddy board, baby board and uncle crutches. :biggthump

[jonbass]

Sorry to hear about the break Steve. Let it heal and come back charging!

I broke my ankle in hard boots years and years ago at Nakiska at a race. I was doing some carving between my runs on an unfamiliar trail. i was in the middle of a carve and the hill had a sudden steep drop. i lost contact with the ground and flew through the air sideways, tumbled a bit and ended up in some trees with a broken ankle, broken binding and cuts on my face and arm. it can be done. In fact, if something clumsy and painful can be done I have probably done it! :D

[Zone]

Bruce V broke his in similar fashion, sudden stop, folded the nose and forward flip. Xray might not show this kind of break, you might need an MRI.
The fact that you can't weight bear right after is often a good indicator of a break. Get seen, get well.

[Buell]

Get it seen ASAP! Make sure you ask them to closely check the Talus.

Money will likely be the last of your worries if it is broken and you do not get it checked out.

[k_t]

I broke mine a couple of years ago from a compression/sudden stop. best advice is get a lace up support from the pharmacy and use it getting to the doc. I made it through two airports with help and to my sports medicine ortho dock and was lucky enough not to need surgery. In my case I think the lace on brace helped keep everything in place. Thank you for that Scott. Kept using the lace on thing with the big black immobilizing boot for six weeks and then good to go. Taking more risk may mean surgery if you are lucky enough to have the bone back in alignment now.

[philw]

Just to add +1.

Mine was basically the same deal. Auger the nose in, twist forward until the front boot blows up. I blew the boot's cant control away before my ankle went.

I suppose it depends on the individual, but I could just about ride to the pick-up where I froze my arse off for a while waiting for a fuel run. They helied me out. After that the pain got steadily worse and I needed something rather better than Tylenol - this required serious drugs.

That was the millennium new year: fortunately I'm not superstitious. No long term effects; didn't ride again that season but did lots of other stuff and by the next season I'd forgotten which foot it was.

[SteveInOregon]

Sorry to hear about the break Steve. Let it heal and come back charging!

I broke my ankle in hard boots years and years ago at Nakiska at a race. I was doing some carving between my runs on an unfamiliar trail. i was in the middle of a carve and the hill had a sudden steep drop. i lost contact with the ground and flew through the air sideways, tumbled a bit and ended up in some trees with a broken ankle, broken binding and cuts on my face and arm. it can be done. In fact, if something clumsy and painful can be done I have probably done it! :D
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MY REPLY: So it looks like hard boots & hard binding are transmitting all the shock & energy to the 1st member in line ( the ankle ) which seams to be an encapsulated prisoner to both weight from above and shock from below.

"POSSIBLE FUTURE REMEDY" ??? > You guys talk about the TD3 with one of the poly urethane type bases being a soft and flexible base cushion , it seams to me in my limited experience , just intuitively that if I were on one of those more lateral forgiving & shock absorbing binding set ups I mite have escaped , what do You think.

Thanks :)

[Erik J]

SteveInOregon - sorry to hear about your injury. I hope you get back to the slopes soon.

What gear were you riding specifically? Your profile says old Rossi bindings & Raichle SBH. Post a pic of your gear if you are able.

I'm reading thoughts here about releasable bindings, softer binding interface, reengineering the gear. I'm sure you've thought over and over about the events that transpired - what would you have done differently from a riding perspective?

[boarderboy]

I'm reading thoughts here about releasable bindings, softer binding interface, reengineering the gear.

Difficult to design but doable in this layman's view.

I'm on hardboots now because of my early attempts to use Earl Miller's release bindings. To the extent that they did release, they worked. The devil was in the details, however.

If I'm not mistaken Fin started an inquiring release binding thread a couple years ago after Bryan's (?) bad SES injury.

As I stated then, "back in the day" I was told Marker had a good design but didn't think there was a market for it.

Because of hardboots' (still small) but greater presence "across the pond", my bet would be that if an all-conditions release binding surfaces, it'll be the Euro's who do it.

My bones and joints look forward to that possibility.

BB

PS Take care of your ankle. Get it fixed, do the rehab, and don't rush back prematurely. Good Luck!!

[Ohob]

I broke mine about 8 years ago... Typical scenario; last run of the day and getting tired but really wanted to hit that perfect jump one more time. :rolleyes:

Came down off balance on my heel-side edge - that old Nitro EFT Asym would not let you get away with that kinda slop - down I went on my hip and the nose of the board slammed into a small mogul at the bottom of the ravine.

I swear i could hear my left ankle 'pop' in my old Koflach Alpintour's! I lay there in pain for a good 5 min ignoring the calls from the lift, then side slipped the rest of the way down the mountain. Any weight it put on my front foot hurt sooooo bad not to mention driving my old POS Volvo w/ a 5-speed back to town, glad i could rev-match.

Good thing was it only took about 8 weeks to heal and it was the end of the season.

[SteveInOregon]

SteveInOregon - sorry to hear about your injury. I hope you get back to the slopes soon.

What gear were you riding specifically? Your profile says old Rossi bindings & Raichle SBH. Post a pic of your gear if you are able.

I'm reading thoughts here about releasable bindings, softer binding interface, reengineering the gear. I'm sure you've thought over and over about the events that transpired - what would you have done differently from a riding perspective?
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Thanks for asking.

1) I would have not gone at all, no seriously, I was super sore and tired from riding 5 hours strait , plus running up steep slope to chase after a school bus on last Thurs. ( read "blinded by laser" ) , so I was "weak in the legs right off the bat.

2) I should have stopped for lunch, but I left my wallet under the seat of my SUV and my lady friend took it down the to Shasta Xcountry ski area to do her thing , she was gone all day with my cash so I was not only , sore & tired I was hungry and thirsty, I couldn't even find a plastic chair to sit on outside to relax because there was a capacity crowd watching a hill jump big air contest and I was left standing * sigh so I thought the lift was the only good seat in the house relax on and so started riding again with no rest.

3) I should have spent the cash on Intuition or other mold-able liners and custom foot beds, "but" being a NuB I didn't have any baseline to evaluate how well my boots fit other than they didn't cut off any circulation so I was positive on my boots, they seamed ok, but I really knew I was going to get better liners, soon but no soon enough.

4) I should really be a "snow snob" and should have gone Xcountry when the conditions are not good, I had ice followed by sunny slush and a thousand weekend skiiers ruts to negotiate.

The moral of the story is, I lead myself down my own path of stupidity aqnd now I am paying for it, the only good thing is I was looking out for "the other guy" , rather than gaining speed and splitting hairs I chose to slow down and drift sideways , oh well live and learn.

PS I will take a few shots and post them of my equip :o

[zoltan]

I had a tib/fib a couple seasons ago from folding the nose.

1. Do you have insurance?

2. Have you seen a doctor yet?

3. Keep the foot elevated, if possible above your heart, generally the higher the better. It will help the swelling immensely.

[Erik J]

My point in asking was this - I don't believe that my equpiment will protect me...not my helmet, not my bindings, nothing. I am the only thing that will protect me. With my limited knowledge of snowboarding, as of now the last thing I want is a releasable binding. It's good to look at equipment and ask questions and evaluate and think and evaluate some more BUT...it sounds like you already know what comes after "but".

FYI, It took me a looooong time to learn to take a break when I became tired on the hill. I can be my own worst enemy sometimes.

Blah blah blah - I hope it's not a serious injury for you. Heal fast.

[Chucklebeast]

Persevere my board broadening brother, elitism is for the birds, and leaves us paying top notch for under produced goods, plus it just isn't the West Coast way, Aloha Style and share the kindness.

That said, jerks abound in every sport, and I'm just glad you're not one of them(been watching your verbal interplay sporadically, hope I'm not slinging crow...), and know your injury is just how life is, don't blame yourself, especially if you are learning from mistakes...riding tired and hungry=bad, and hypocrite that I am, I do it all the time due to over pricing at the vendors and my amp level as I blast out the door seldom leads to a sack lunch.

Any updates on your condition? Hoping your not wincing like I am at every downhill crash in the Olympics...that thread even threatened me, LOL!

Packing my lunch as I listen to rock, Aloha, C.

[Dave ESPI]

sooooo Steve,

Make an appointment yet to see a Dr. ?

[SteveInOregon]

Persevere my board broadening brother, elitism is for the birds, and leaves us paying top notch for under produced goods, plus it just isn't the West Coast way, Aloha Style and share the kindness.

That said, jerks abound in every sport, and I'm just glad you're not one of them(been watching your verbal interplay sporadically, hope I'm not slinging crow...), and know your injury is just how life is, don't blame yourself, especially if you are learning from mistakes...riding tired and hungry=bad, and hypocrite that I am, I do it all the time due to over pricing at the vendors and my amp level as I blast out the door seldom leads to a sack lunch.

Any updates on your condition? Hoping your not wincing like I am at every downhill crash in the Olympics...that thread even threatened me, LOL!

Packing my lunch as I listen to rock, Aloha, C.
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MY REPLY : >:biggthump Thanks for the island cheers.

Ya my amp is the same as yours, I set out everything the night before, I wax and stone at night while listening to the radio, check boot to bindings bla bla bla.

I make sure everything is as good as possible ( very necessary with old used equip ) everything has to be perfect as can be so I can just park, stretch & suit up and hit the lift 1st thing.

Since Your an island guy you must surf >( I didn't look at your profile yet) you know what its like to scrape sand wax off then re-wax up, make sure your suit (Cali cold water ) substitute fav trunks / suit isn't all stank from the day before , make sure you have fresh rinse water bla bla bla so when I get to the cliff's I can drink coffee and check the set, no time waisted.

Howlie "out", lol.:)

[SteveInOregon]

sooooo Steve,

Make an appointment yet to see a Dr. ?
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MY REPLY: ( looking sheepish, avoiding eye contact )
:o No-ooo not yet

[lamby]

Sorry to hear about your injury Steve - hope you make a speedy recovery.

I've been following this thread only intermittently, so forgive me if I am less than completely informed about your condition, but am I correct in my understanding that you have not seen a doctor about your ankle yet?

It might be a really good idea to go see an orthopedic doc about your condition and how you came to hurt yourself.

My wife broke her ankle (talus) hard-booting two years ago, but it went undiagnosed for two weeks. Her x-rays showed no break. Doc said Rest, Ice, elevate the ankle. If in two weeks you are not better we will need to do an MRI. In two weeks, still painful to walk on. MRI revealed break of talus (inner ankle bone). Surgery and rehab, but better than what would have happened if it went untreated. The bone can die, (narcrocis - sp??). Talus break is a fairly common snowboarding injury that is often misdiagnosed by docs - they are not often trained to look for this injury.

My wife was back carving the following winter (last season) and is really doing better this season. Still has some pain, but with lots of stretching and p.t. is doing better every day. I really think you need to see an orthopedic specialist about your injury asap.

By the way, she broke it in a toe-side turn. She carved in to a pile of man-made snow from the groomed run and got into heavy boot chatter - bang, bang, bang... - felt the pain on the first bang. Boots buckled up loosely - it was a cold day and she had boot covers on and had forgot to tighten her boots up on the chair-lift ride up, so she was riding with her boots done up only loosely. She was riding with her boots in walk-mode too.

[patmoore]

Can U break an ankle in hardboots?

Short answer is - yes.


http://i47.tinypic.com/28191g6.jpg

[SteveInOregon]

Sorry to hear about your injury Steve - hope you make a speedy recovery.

I've been following this thread only intermittently, so forgive me if I am less than completely informed about your condition, but am I correct in my understanding that you have not seen a doctor about your ankle yet?

It might be a really good idea to go see an orthopedic doc about your condition and how you came to hurt yourself.

My wife broke her ankle (talus) hard-booting two years ago, but it went undiagnosed for two weeks. Her x-rays showed no break. Doc said Rest, Ice, elevate the ankle. If in two weeks you are not better we will need to do an MRI. In two weeks, still painful to walk on. MRI revealed break of talus (inner ankle bone). Surgery and rehab, but better than what would have happened if it went untreated. The bone can die, (narcrocis - sp??). Talus break is a fairly common snowboarding injury that is often misdiagnosed by docs - they are not often trained to look for this injury.

My wife was back carving the following winter (last season) and is really doing better this season. Still has some pain, but with lots of stretching and p.t. is doing better every day. I really think you need to see an orthopedic specialist about your injury asap.

By the way, she broke it in a toe-side turn. She carved in to a pile of man-made snow from the groomed run and got into heavy boot chatter - bang, bang, bang... - felt the pain on the first bang. Boots buckled up loosely - it was a cold day and she had boot covers on and had forgot to tighten her boots up on the chair-lift ride up, so she was riding with her boots done up only loosely. She was riding with her boots in walk-mode too.
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MY REPLY: OK, You and the other guys have got me convinced ( the dying bone thing got me > :eek:.

I'm gonna go see Dr Talus 2morrow, Than:)ks

[SteveInOregon]

Can U break an ankle in hardboots?

Short answer is - yes.


http://i47.tinypic.com/28191g6.jpg

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MY REPLY: Hay my friend, how come you got a Gold medal for breaking your ankle and I didn't .

My routine was pretty good maybe not a gold metal gymnast routine like yours,lol, but I did do nose dive hook high side front flip over, a loud yelp followed by rolling around in deep off trail snow moaning and groaning,lol.

I think I should at least get a bronze for the moaning & groaning part :(

[terekhov]

sure you can. have ankle injury for almost 3 years no - stuffed nose when speeding through soft moguls, cartwheeled and stopped when board dead-stopped and body tries to fly out from boots - yes, I had great momentum. ankle seriously sprained - I feel it every other day of riding... (