New riding buddy

[BlueB]

I've got a new riding buddy! Ahhm, make that a skiing buddy - I'm not brave enough to carry him while boarding. Still managed few gentle ski carves down the green run.
My son's name is Luka, he's 15 months old, this was his 1st day on the slopes. He loved it. We did 4 runs down Collins, our longest green cruiser. My small 163 Heads felt really wobbly with extra 10lbs I packed from last year + Luka's 30lbs... Should have brought the GS skis...
We drew as much attention in the lift lines as the alpine boards do.
...
For the people not familiar with Cypress, in the background you can see 2 of the better carving runs we've got. Beyond the 1st chairlift, Midway, is the Lower Bowen, steep blue. Beyond the 2nd chairlift, Lyons Express, is the Rainbow, a moderate black.

[Powercarver129]

Nice! he'll be all over the slopes before you know it. Make sure you don't fall while you're carrying him!! (I know you did greens so I'm sure it's fine). That mountain looks really good compared to Massachusetts right now.

[mr_roboteye]

Lookin' good Boris. (yer' son too.) When I was a lifty at Whistler / Blackcomb, there would be the odd person with a kiddie backpack like you had, and some other people would approach me and nearly demand that we not allow people to ski with their kids on their backs. I just replied that the mountain didn't have a policy regarding that, and as long as all reasonable precautions were taken there isn't a problem with it. I agree, and I bet you ski very carefully with such precious cargo on your back. I can see how he would love it.

happy carves.

Dave R.

[BlueB]

people would approach me and nearly demand that we not allow people to ski with their kids on their backs
It's funny how there are always people minding someone else's business... Good answer from your side. Cypress does have a bit unclear policy on backpacks while riding the chairlift, though. They could make me take the carrier off and put it next to me on the chair. I can't quite see how that would be safer for the kid.
Greatest danger would be someone crushing into us, actually.
It boils down to the same old - should one stay on the couch for ever and be safe, or you actually go out and do the fun stuff? Sooner or later, the kid would be charging these same slopes on his own and I would have, by far, less control on his safety...

Boris

[eaglez]

Hey Boris,

I was wondering about the chair ride. Do you take the pack off when you ride up, or just sit forward on the chair with him on your back? We had a guy years ago that was an instructor at our club and he skied at mach 2 with his small son on his back when he wasn't teaching. Made me cringe everytime I saw him. He never had an incident but it sure looked like he could have. Skiing more gently would have been better, for the people that watched and worried about him.:ices_ange But you are right, better to get out there instead of carving the couch! If he grows up outdoors, he will probably be more apt to prefer the snowsports to the couch (videogame) sports.

D.:biggthump

[BlueB]

I keep the carrier on. Just sit slightly sideways to load the chair and drop the safety bar. Later I can carry on sitting diagonally or striaghten up and lean on the bar...

[dredman]

I too spent many days riding with my son in the pack. I did ride one of my carving boards, just not very aggressively. Riding with the most precious cargo in the world on your back does keep the speed down. I was lucky enough to be at a ski area that only had 1 T-Bar, so the lift was never a problem. We did loose a pair of mittens so be sure to have a keeper string for anything that can come off.

I still chuckle when I think of him slapping me on the shoulder and helmet shouting "Faster Papa Faster!!"

Now he is 10 and ski racing. Seems to be fitting him very well. I am very proud of his lust for riding and I smile from ear to ear when I see him ride. He has not been very interested in the snowboards. I guess he wants to do something different than his parents. He did make about 7 runs on his Burton 135 Factory Prime this weekend so there is hope. I do not care if he skis or snowboards as long as he is having fun, being curtious and respectful at the ski hills.

Keep up all the good work all you parents! Your bunny hill / backpack time will not last long, but your memories will.

The first picture is from 99? and the second is from last spring 07.

[Victory]

Boris, it's killing me that I'm not in Vancouver during this killer season you're having! Then again Fernie just keeps getting pounded, so I can't complain.

[andreac]

That's amazing to take your little one out with you on the slopes, and i don't want to be that person getting in your business, but I just want to recommend a helmut for you too. Luca has one and while the hope is that there is a never a crash that you need it, doesn't it make sense for you to have one too so you can continue to rip it up with him for years to come, in the event that a crash happens?
:smashfrea don't let this happen to you!

[BlueB]

Andrea, thanks for your concern.
I actually do have a helmet and ski, board and teach with it ALWAYS, no matter how hot a day or how small a hill. It saved my mellon few times.
I decided not to have it on when I carry Luka, so in the case of crash his face wouldn't hit my helmet. Folded took is a tad softer and full 2" inches further away...

[pebu]

And easier to turn to check on the little guy. No obstruction of view.

[bjvircks]

I still chuckle when I think of him slapping me on the shoulder and helmet shouting "Faster Papa Faster!!"

Outstanding !!! I am deeply envious of all you folks who have the opportunity to do this with your kids. Of course, stay safe... but share the passions of your life!:biggthump

[BadBrad]

Cool stuff. I am adopting a 7 month old boy on Thursday, and looking forward to when I can take him to the slopes.

[BlueB]

Yesterday we tried another ski outing. They hardly let us into the ski area and not at all on the chairlifts. Since we were spotted last time, someone made sure that parents with kiddies in the carriers are banned from the slopes/chairs. :( :( :(

[NateW]

Bummer.

[carvedog]

Yesterday we tried another ski outing. They hardly let us into the ski area and not at all on the chairlifts. Since we were spotted last time, someone made sure that parents with kiddies in the carriers are banned from the slopes/chairs. :( :( :(

Yeah I tried to get on the lifts with my 18 month old and was totally shut down. In retaliation, while I was trying to get clarification on what is allowed, she dropped trou and peed in the lift line. In about 2 seconds too.

You can kind of understand, some people can barely load and unload themselves let alone a little youngster in a pack. Don't know how Canada is but down here the personal injury lawyers would have a field day in event of an injury.

I have been known to just pick up and carry youngsters off the hill when they have hit their limit. Always gets a chuckle and/or questionlng looks. Definitely not recommended for most. I have spent so much time toting camera gear and backpacks that a 30-40 lb kid doesn't seem so bad.

Sorry to hear that can't ski with your buddy though.

[eaglez]

Yesterday we tried another ski outing. They hardly let us into the ski area and not at all on the chairlifts. Since we were spotted last time, someone made sure that parents with kiddies in the carriers are banned from the slopes/chairs. :( :( :(

Hey B, I just want to put a few keystrokes to screen on this. In my opinion, there are 2 things to think about here. The least important is the resort's liability standpoint. The most important in my opinion is that so many things could go wrong that aren't your fault. The reasons we generally wear helmets in the first place is to protect us from all of the things that we have control over as well as the things we have no control over. The ways you can be smoked by some dick on the hill are unpredictable. I would assume that you might be skiing with your child on the blue or green runs. Generally where the majority of people of questionable ability frequent. It would only take one hit or an edge catch that might not injure you but knock you over and your childs head hits the ice. The thought of that happening to mine or anyones kids brings tears to my eyes. Having 2 kids, 6 and 10 who have been skiing since 3, their safety is my #1 concern. They continue to be professionally instructed and I have taught them how to be as safe as possible and ski/board defensively and be aware of what is around at all times. It doesn't matter if they had the right of way, if the offending person smokes them and they are injured. It doesn't matter much who is at fault if my kid is dead. :( Sorry about the rant. :ices_ange Like I mentioned in my earlier post, that instructor at my old club years ago got lucky in my opinion that nothing happened while packing his kid around on the hill. There will be lots of time to get on the hill with Luca and it won't be long.

Also, I have a quiver of small boards that I would like to be able to send your way when the time comes. So I wouldn't want anything to happen to you or your son. :ices_ange

D.:biggthump

[Neil Gendzwill]

eaglez, can you explain how your 3 year old skiing by himself is any safer from getting hit by people than Boris' kid is on his back?

[eaglez]

eaglez, can you explain how your 3 year old skiing by himself is any safer from getting hit by people than Boris' kid is on his back?

My last post wasn't intended to induce a flame war. :ices_ange It was just opinion. And it wasn't intended as a knock against Boris. He and I have spoke offline alot over the years and he sold me a small board that might make it back to his house someday. And I respect what he is trying to do. I was just pointing out a couple of issues with it. As for my kids when they were 3, our hill has a Kids Corral that is fenced off from the general ski population with its own magic carpet. Not even parents can get in while instruction is going on. There is a set of bleachers where you can watch. So I would say that is pretty safe. As for free skiing after lessons, obviously there is an element of danger in any sport, but I assure you that the speeds my snowplowing 3 year olds travelling 2 feet in front of me were no where near the speeds that even a careful free skiing adult with a kid on his back would achieve. And even if I got hit by someone, I would rather take the hit than my kid in front of me. Like I said, anything can happen through no fault of your own. And if it turns ugly here, I will just delete and forget the whole thing.
D.:biggthump

[crucible]

Part of the reason for Cypress Mountain being draconian towards Boris and his new son might be because the resort is part of Boyne USA.

Even though Cypress Mountain is in Canada and the liability laws are very different from the United States, Boyne's position might be held universally across all of their resorts.

Any way you look at it it's a bummer.

Boris, you might just have to introduce Luka to the joys of backcountry skiing- they can't do squat to you in a BC Provincial park. I started taking my daughter Maya off piste at Cypress when she at the same age that Luka is now. Next year she'll be backcountry touring with me on her own steam...

[David Glynn]

My kids skied in the womb. We skied them in back packs. And they started skiing as soon as they could walk. They of course can't remember learning to ski. If you can ski as well as you can walk I don't see an issue. If you are a little shaky then..................??????
I know that my kids loved it. I would do it again in a heart beat.
Our ski area does not allow it anymore and I think it is a shame

[BlueB]

And if it turns ugly here, I will just delete and forget the whole thing.
Daren,
No need deleting. No flame wars here. I read your post just as the pure concern... I appreciate everyone's opinion.

I worked at kids camp for few years and understand the dangers of little ones skiing on their own. Thanks goodness, I never had a child taken out by an out of controll skier... However, I did have a kid, not in my reach (quad chair), missing on the chair offloading area and falling from a high spot, face first. I have been taken out by a skier once as the kid. Bastard didn't hurt me but broke his ski hitting a tree he took me into. My dad was about to brake his skull, too ;) I was taken out, early this year, while mellow carving on a green run by a straightlining skier... You are in danger as soon as you leave the couch. I can live with it.

And yes, in few years I'll need your son's tiny alpine stick back! Keep it in the good shape for Luka.

Boris

[photodad2001]

It's funny how there are always people minding someone else's business...

Excellent observation there!!! I had my daughter out fishing one day and there was a woman with her 2 children at the lake. My daughter (who can cast better than most adults) kept trying to get as close as she could to this weed bed. Of course I had to keep taking the weeds off her hook and had told her that she didn't need to try to get as close as she was trying. Well... I told her I wasn't going to take the weed off her hook the next time. This lady, who was in earshot obviously didn't think that very "parental" of me and began watching us, waiting for my daughter to get weeds on her hook again. (She also looked the type that would say that fishing is not an activity to be teaching your child as it involves the tourture of living beings yada yada...) Of course she put it in the weed bed again and this time I told her to take it off herself. She stood there looking at it holding the line just above the hook, not willing to take it off. (this from a girl who I had to tell to stop playing with the grubs) Finally I told her to hold her hand out and proceeded to put a piece of the weed into her hand. At that moment the lady came bursting over and began a lecture of "parental compassion" and other far left propaganda. I started to pack up to leave then saw what HER children were doing.

While she was deep into her liberal bleeding heart book of how trees have feelings too she had no idea that her children were a couple hundred yards away playing on a dock that was under construction. There they were jumping from pylon to pylon, must have had to crawl under all the yellow caution tape. I pointed and asked, "are those your kids?" She ran off screaming and didn't come back. Just thought the timing of the event was perfect.

[photodad2001]

I just want you to know before I start that I love the fact you are a conserned parent, but this isn't child abuse and I should let you know I wanted to say something before about a comment that you made.

When you pointed out that my daughter wasn't wearing a helmet and you "cringed" I did feel that my parenting abilities were being attacked. I should let you know that her father, me, used to ride in the back of a pick-up truck with no cab, sitting on the wheel well cruizing down the highway at her age. (not that I'd let her do it) I used to jump my bike on ramps built by me and my friends made of logs and boards found behind the garage with nails sticking out. (we'd put the side with least amount of nails down of course) I rode my friends half-pipe inside his barn with no pads and no helmet. To come clean, I have never owned a helmet and the only time I can remember needing one was when I broke my nose on some ice taking one face first. I put my hands out, but they went east and west. I didn't go out and buy a full face helmet after that either.

Look at figure skating. Everyone makes fun of how... "hetero-challanged" it is and these guys are basically pulling 720's and 1080's on a surface as hard as concrete and obviouslly as slippery as a sheet of ice and never touch a helmet. I guess these guys will be "More Core" at the next winter olympics.

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[carvedog]

Hey - that's Sun Valley. It still looks the same but it's 45 years later. :p
Out back of the lodge. I haven't been fairly anti-ice skating since they went from live snowboard racing to ice skating practice during the Nagano Olympics. I know, I know that is a long time to carry a grudge. Trying to get over it.

With two girls though I ain't getting away from it. Last year the chamber gave away some tickets for the ice shows so my wife and I took the girls. Predictably twirly and my girls loved it. Then this girl came out in some kind of PG rated S&M outfit and twirled around a bunch of hula hoops and rolling around this circle thing ( think about the starfish and having handles there to roll around on the ice. :eplus2::eek::eplus2:

And she wasn't wearing a helmet either. That's all. See no thread jack Mom.

[b0ardski]

my grandson got on ice skates (in Hawaii of all places) at the age of 2, with his bike helmet. should be a given for small children.
As far being "hetero-challenged", for some reason I prefer watching pretty young girls getting thrown into the air, pulling a tight 1080, and sticking it fakie on 1 1/8inch blade at 20 klicks on ice covered concrete, to watching a bunch of armoured 200lb guys take each other out with sticks. that only makes me non-canadian, not gay

[photodad2001]

my grandson got on ice skates (in Hawaii of all places) at the age of 2, with his bike helmet. should be a given for small children.
As far being "hetero-challenged", for some reason I prefer watching pretty young girls getting thrown into the air, pulling a tight 1080, and sticking it fakie on 1 1/8inch blade at 20 klicks on ice covered concrete, to watching a bunch of armoured 200lb guys take each other out with sticks. that only makes me non-canadian, not gay

I know there are a large number of H-C participants, but for those who aren't, some of the lifts they perform in couples skating would make it worth the stereotype.:D

[eaglez]

Thanks Boris, enjoy your summers everyone...............................:biggthump

[Silver Surfer]

I know there are a large number of H-C participants, but for those who aren't, some of the lifts they perform in couples skating would make it worth the stereotype.:D

Ahh, Yes. But have you over looked that one thing? Would it truly be worth it if you had to wear the ball hugger spandex pants ??
That is the question.

Think the Spandex 1 piece just might be a deal killer.Lemme check!
Yup! 4 out of 6 Beer drinking redneck hippys here say that it's all good, sterotype and all.
Until you have wear the spandex pant's
:DSS

[photodad2001]

Ahh, Yes. But have you over looked that one thing? Would it truly be worth it if you had to wear the ball hugger spandex pants ??
That is the question.

I wear them under my baggies!!! I like to feel supported.

[Randy T.]

Hey Borris I sent you a couple e-mails but they got kicked back. Can you send me an e-mail.

[BlueB]

Email sent.

[BlueB]

My 18 months old riding buddy just watched whole of the Hard Attack with me! First half he actually set on the couch with me, 2nd part he ran around the room.
He was genuinely interested and commented at the right spots, saying:
Snow!
Fell!
Fast!
Opa!
Gone...
At the end he kinda staired at the tv in disbelief, wanting more...

[Steve Prokopiw]

Our 2 1/2 year old,Nathan, had his first session of snowboarding today with mommy on the bunnyhill.He laughed the whole time he was in motion and kept telling Maureen not to touch him since that meant he would have to slow down.He did three trips down the 500 foot run.I'm a proud papa.

[Hugh]

Hello Boris,

15 months? :) Time does fly, it was only yesterday that you were expecting :1luvu:

I never thought of downhill skiing with my little kids, but I did cross country ski a few times with one in a backpack and also with a rental sled. X country would be a lot safer and not even require helmets. Plus, nobody gets in your business.

Enjoy,

Hugh

[Steve Prokopiw]

to the bomber family! I meant to post this last week whenthese pics were taken.This is 2 1/2 year old Nathan with mommy ,following in his big bro's footsteps(and his boots).His first session and he did the whole bunny hill three times.Ain't he cute?! :)

[lukcy]

It's awesome to see so many parents on here! My daughter will be 4 this coming season, and hasn't been on the snow as much as she should! A little curious...you start your little ones skiing first, right? Seeing as snowboarding requires a lot of leg muscle, and body weight distribution (kids weight is all in the head). I tell everyone that I won't put my daughter on a board until she can ski in control on a bunny slope.

[eastcoasticerider]

Its work but it pays off....I started my girls boarding way back when they were little kids...soon you guys will be packing them off to their first professional job. Heres me and my daughter enjoying a day together at Sunday River. I know both kids will always love the snow and pass it on to their kids.....rock on junior jedi !

[Steve Prokopiw]

It's awesome to see so many parents on here! My daughter will be 4 this coming season, and hasn't been on the snow as much as she should! A little curious...you start your little ones skiing first, right? Seeing as snowboarding requires a lot of leg muscle, and body weight distribution (kids weight is all in the head). I tell everyone that I won't put my daughter on a board until she can ski in control on a bunny slope.

If your child refuses to ski because mommy and daddy snowboard conventional wisdom won't mean a thing.Our oldest decided at three he would snowboard and that was that.He now has decided to ski too;snowboarding gave him as much of a headstart on skiing as the other way around.The leg strength notion doesn't hold water with us, since no 3-4 year old kid has the strength to flex a ski boot and is lucky if he or she can flex a snowboard boot.Kids fall better than adults in my teaching experience and a snowboard is easier to fall well with and to get up on ,once they have the movement sequence for doing so.Disclaimer; in my humble opinion:)

[lukcy]

If your child refuses to ski because mommy and daddy snowboard conventional wisdom won't mean a thing.Our oldest decided at three he would snowboard and that was that.He now has decided to ski too;snowboarding gave him as much of a headstart on skiing as the other way around.The leg strength notion doesn't hold water with us, since no 3-4 year old kid has the strength to flex a ski boot and is lucky if he or she can flex a snowboard boot.Kids fall better than adults in my teaching experience and a snowboard is easier to fall well with and to get up on ,once they have the movement sequence for doing so.Disclaimer; in my humble opinion:)

Hmm, interesting way to look at it. Mainly, because she didn't want to ski. She wanted to snowboard, because Mommy does. She's pretty tiny for her age, very petite. So I didn't think snowboarding would be a good idea. Think I should try her on one this season?

[photodad2001]

30 whacks if they don't hold that toe edge!!!!!!:lol:

[EnisiWaya]

Hi Boris glad things are sorta going better for you.

I have started in with some Bowen Technique therapy. It is workings wonders according to the wife. Even if i am not sure after celebrating our 32 anniversary on May 15 I will always trust her judgment.


As to getting the little ones on the slopes:

I'd like to re-iterate something I have spoken of before.

At this age children develop New muscles and skills rapidly as they learn to walk and talk. So If they are given the right environment and learn ski or snowboard skill on dry land, you can put them on snow at age two and they have better motor skills and muscle development for snow sports than the average 6 year old.


Son Sam and the others Were skiing and riding the T-bar solo in the beginner area at age two. At age three they were skiing the whole mountain, and not in a wedge/snowplow either.

So I have games for the living room for skiing maybe we can join up in the off season and figure out some for snowboard. then we could put together a first draft book and have this on line community act as editors. then we could self publish it. Set up a non profit for any net gains to to have a fund/org that provides loaner gear on cheap deposit for parents to start their children out with dryland and then on snow at age 15 months to four years.

What do you think Boris?
and what to all you guys and gals think ?


I helped write the original SkiWee manual so I have a cloudy vague:confused: idea of how to do a technical manual for parents.


Feedback please!


GWS

[EnisiWaya]

Just a note At Ragged Mountain we had special snowboards for a Nursery program with 3 to 5 year olds as one on one with an instructor.

So the gear does exist. There was a lot of debate on wether to use soft boots or hard. As most of the littles ones had not had dry land we used ski boots for them. With a proper dry land pre-snow training program I would for sure go with soft boots to allow them to develop muscles, balance and flexibility.

[pebu]

It's kinda funny seeing all these parents getting their kids into boarding. I sure will when I'm a parent. But the reason I find it funny is because I actually got my dad on the snow. We took snowboarding lessons together and he boarded for a few years. I wish I would have known about hardbooting back in the day because that was the kind of boarding he did. Even though, I guess he didn't do perfect half circles as much as he looked like a sailboat going down a small lake (tight corners, but no definitive transition anywhere). A few years ago (Gosh, probably 6 or 7 by now) he buried the nose in some soft stuff though and went over the handlebars, landing on his shoulder. He tore the ligament that connects to the clavicle and even today he can make his clavicle pop up over the rest of his shoulder and it looks real nasty. But those were some good times. Now we stick to golfing together (which I also got him into). He teaches me about business and mechanics and building houses and jewelry making and such and I try to teach him about what to do in the time he's not doing that.

[Steve Prokopiw]

Hmm, interesting way to look at it. Mainly, because she didn't want to ski. She wanted to snowboard, because Mommy does. She's pretty tiny for her age, very petite. So I didn't think snowboarding would be a good idea. Think I should try her on one this season?

My kids are very stong little guys but shorter than average.We have used hoola hoops at first with good success, as well a harness.My oldest didn't like the harness but our youngest is fine with it .Funny thing is he didn't seem to need one for snowboarding.Hoola hoops are my favorite if needed;the biggest ones I can find so the kid is inside it and I have room to kick turn beside him while holding it from outside the hoop.I don't use my 185 for this:)

[BlueB]

So I have games for the living room for skiing maybe we can join up in the off season and figure out some for snowboard. then we could put together a first draft book and have this on line community act as editors. then we could self publish it. Set up a non profit for any net gains to to have a fund/org that provides loaner gear on cheap deposit for parents to start their children out with dryland and then on snow at age 15 months to four years.

Great thoughts, Brother. It would be nice producing a manual like that. Gear idea is also great.
While I can teach a very young kid to ski, I wouldn't have a clue where to start with a snowboard. How do you play the dry-land games with both feet strapped in?
I'm in. I would do the technical part of the manual - layouts, photo/illustration editing, pdf publishing. I probably can host it for download on my site, unless Fin wanted it on Bomber.
I could try to do some demo photos of any drills you might suggest, if my youngter wanted to cooperate. He can be very hyper and head-strong at the times. But I'm sure there's others with tiny kids who might want to participate.
Let's hear the thoughts from the others.

Boris

PS I'm very glad you feel a bit better.

[carvedog]

Boris - sorry for the thread jack. Your direct email is bouncing back.
Please email me.

carvedog

jerry at saddletreegallery dat com.