Tinkler Split Nose Proto-Type

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

Mike first cut the nose of a race board in 1996!! It was a project that would not be re-vived for several years. This past season , among numerous other projects, Mike re-visited his "Split Nose" technology. Those that have ridden his boards know the difference his bindings plates, driver plates , snow-stix and split tail technologies make. Enough so, that to date almost every board owner has ordered a second! After spending the late spring in testing, Mike has moved from proto-typing to production. His first split tip and tail board built specifically for this technology is on it's way to South America for on snow testing. Here are some photos of the proto type (http://www.finelineclub.com/pics/main.php?g2_itemId=3886) that helped to set the final specs for the currently developing models. I only got a couple spring days on it , but it was amazing! I can't wait to get one on real winter hard pack! I don't have their ok yet, however I can say that there are orders in and boards being built as we speak. Mike promises photo before they ship. I will hold off on specs etc until the owners chose to "roll-out" their new Tinkler Full split system boards.

The new boards do not have the extra inserts and flex shunts. This was a part of the testing phase. Providing adjustablility in an effort to pin point the "where" and "how much" factors.
Yes, I did get a bit of extra snow through the split, however Mike cuts them in a way that minimizes this. See the last photo in the gallery for a shot after a "slushy" spring run. I loved being able to adjust both tip and tail.
Thanks to the locals that kept the "Secret" under their hats for the last couple months. Much appreciated!
When do I get mine??
Mike has several current orders to complete prior to November, however he tells me he has room for two more orders that he can promise completion before the snow flys. Please don't call in December and expect to have it by Christmas. Now is a good time to get your board started.

[James Ong]

Your not that far away from having a split board :)
OR SKIS :eplus2:

[Jack Michaud]

Interesting. So you could "theoretically" have a stiffer board on toeside or heelside, and a softer board on the other side. If you wanted to, that is. Perhaps these boards should be named "Tinkerer" instead!

Coiler did a split tail and nose board a number of years ago.

I'm still not sold on the whole concept of partially split boards. I would think it would put a kink in the flex pattern. But I've never ridden one.

[tex1230]

Bryan,

Have there been any failures in the Tinkel split tails? My (limited) experience with split tails was breaking 2 burners in 3 days...

Just wondering if Mike has been able to strengthen the design while maintaining flex...

[Hans]

Well, this is an amazing thing. Just have to ride my Tinkler 202 splittail with titanal plate first which came in last week. Can't wait to ride mine, first thing. Never seen such nice craftmanship, thanks, Mike. He's done a nice job :biggthump :biggthump
Just anxious to hear about the ridingperformance of this new 'tail/nosesplitter'.

Greets, Hans.

[Speedzilla]

Ok, I have to ask......how much $? :cool:

[pokkis]

These are all unique master pieces, so also prices are not equal. So best answer you get from man itself, Mike :ices_ange

[Ray]

In the neighborhood of $1500 – $1900… depending of what you want… I think…

[Speedzilla]

ahhh....it's in the "don't even ask the wife" category.

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

Interesting. So you could "theoretically" have a stiffer board on toeside or heelside, and a softer board on the other side. If you wanted to, that is. Perhaps these boards should be named "Tinkerer" instead!

Bingo!, Except it is not theoretical, it is what we have been doing with the split tail . It allowed the rider to adjust the flex of the tail along with the dampening. Example is my heel side is my strong side. I can stiffen it up and soften the toe side to get a bit more flex if I want. Being able to tune the board on the fly is one of it's advantages. The others are dampening and overall performance.

As Pokis pointed out, every board starts from scratch. Every core is created and profiled with a rider in mind. Each Tinkler I have ridden is different from the other. Some more similar than others. One of the reasons I would like to get as many Tinkler owners together some time and do some serious testing. There just aren't many out there to "borrow" and the owners tend to be pretty reluctant to hand over their prize board.

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

Bryan,

Have there been any failures in the Tinkler split tails? My (limited) experience with split tails was breaking 2 burners in 3 days...

Just wondering if Mike has been able to strengthen the design while maintaining flex...

Good question Matt. Trust me the Sims Burner and it's issues were not unknown to Mike. We are all big fans of the Burner. He was there so to speak! Tom Sims was the first (and only, please don't quote me on this one) to actually provide inserts factory for the Tinkler Snow-Stix from the factory. As a collector I am looking for the Snow-Stix that came with a Sims sticker on them. Let me know if you have one. Back to your question. As of this date , I do not know of any broken tails. Mike definitely builds them in differently and there is a balance between flex and protecting the split. I know I have taken a few fairly knarly beaters with no damage. Understanding that nothing is unbreakable.
Some are hard on noses , some are hard on tails. If you are breaking allot of tails, I would not recommend you have a split built even knowing Mike's board will hold up very well. Hope that helps. Bryan

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

Well, this is an amazing thing. Just have to ride my Tinkler 202 splittail with titanal plate first which came in last week. Can't wait to ride mine, first thing. Never seen such nice craftmanship, thanks, Mike. He's done a nice job :biggthump :biggthump
Just anxious to hear about the ridingperformance of this new 'tail/nosesplitter'.

Greets, Hans.

Love to hear back Hans, glad it arrived safe and sound!

[Jack Michaud]

Bingo!, Except it is not theoretical, it is what we have been doing with the split tail .

Okay, I suppose tuning the flex is not theoretical, but I think the benefit to a carved turn is. I mean, I can't see how a split in a board can do anything to the flex pattern other than put a kink or hinge in it at the point where the split begins. Therefor, the board is not going to bend into a smooth arc along its entire length. I know the problem of boards kinking in the middle is what Donek sought to remedy with its quadratic sidecut and specially matched flex pattern. Sean has some very interesting side-by-side closeups of boards in mid-carve and the results are telling.

Perhaps this is not a bad thing, in the case of a split tail board like a Burner, where you are supposed to mount them ahead of center - maybe the length of the board ahead of the split handles the job of carving, and the length of the board behind the split handles some other job (quasi-suspension?). Perhaps.

But I just don't see a benefit to putting two kinks in a board. Theoretically, of course!

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

In the neighborhood of $1500 – $1900… depending of what you want… I think…
Correct, a "System" board starts at around 1750$ A board with a driver plate , binding plate and/or Snow-Stix. The boards being built with Titanal are more , each board is unique.

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

Okay, I suppose tuning the flex is not theoretical, but I think the benefit to a carved turn is. I mean, I can't see how a split in a board can do anything to the flex pattern other than put a kink or hinge in it at the point where the split begins. Therefor, the board is not going to bend into a smooth arc along its entire length. I know the problem of boards kinking in the middle is what Donek sought to remedy with its quadratic sidecut and specially matched flex pattern. Sean has some very interesting side-by-side closeups of boards in mid-carve and the results are telling.

Perhaps this is not a bad thing, in the case of a split tail board like a Burner, where you are supposed to mount them ahead of center - maybe the length of the board ahead of the split handles the job of carving, and the length of the board behind the split handles some other job (quasi-suspension?). Perhaps.

But I just don't see a benefit to putting two kinks in a board. Theoretically, of course!

If that were the case , I wouldn't either.
Quite the opposite, I have yet to ride anything smoother, more flowing.
Those that followed my methods, know I will ride/ buy / what works for me.
I have been fortunate enough to have some very fine snowboards over the years. The good ones "Raise The Bar" and change my perspective. Mike's boards have made it very hard to ride "Mono Construction" boards regardless of builder. Even riding his boards without a plate or stixs is quite a difference.

Jack, if you can pry Mike away from building boards long enough, I think you would enjoy the conversation. Flex and dampening have been on Mike's brain since he was a scrappy little surfer kid in New Zealand and HI. It moved from theory to real world before you were born.
:Sorry, now I know why old guys love to use that :eplus2:

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

These are all unique master pieces, so also prices are not equal. So best answer you get from man itself, Mike :ices_ange
Well said, from another guy that appears willing to try anything in a quest for the ultimate carving experience.

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

Your not that far away from having a split board :)
OR SKIS :eplus2:
James, I only wish I had the wide "Ryan M" board when I was at Mt Rose. I would have loved to see what an ECer of your caliber would have had to say. Given that it is shorter and stiffer than you might prefer. Still trying to figure out to do with a 20cm wide board. :confused: I know , I know, "Go wide, you will never go back" :p I rode the board and I loved the sidecut and it was beefy, the transition just felt like I was driving a lumber truck and it is the lightest shortest Tinkler I have!! You guys do friggin rip!!! (http://www.finelineclub.com/videos/mtrose_carving_sm.wmv) Thanks again for an excellent day!! (http://www.finelineclub.com/pics/main.php?g2_itemId=446&g2_page=2)

PS. I know this photo is Rob not James, but I just got lucky and snapped his at a better time. James photo (two pictures ahead is about a 1/2 second too late) Photographer wanna be's fault.

[Ray]

Bryan,

Can you post the specs for this proto type?

Lengths, waist and nose/tail.

Thanks
Ray

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

Bryan,

Can you post the specs for this proto type?

Lengths, waist and nose/tail.

Thanks
Ray

Here you go: Keep in mind this is approx. (measured free-hand)

Overall Length: 190cm
Running Length:172.5 (contact pt to contact pt)
Tip Width: 23.3cm
Waist Width: 18.3cm
Tail Width: 22.5

[Ray]

Sure, I still have it at my place. Shhh! Hoping Mike forgets I have it. :freak3: Yeh right!
I will have to measure it. Give me a day.

Bryan

Ok, thanks.

Bryan, I have the strong feeling you will need to get your own (which I think you will), Mike will NOT forget :p
I heard a couple more boards are going under the press this week. Seems he is moving ahead nicely...

Ray

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

Yes, I think you are quite right I am afraid.
Yes, I am anxious to see one of the T N T Splits!
It complicates things a bit, I now have TWO boards
I need to have built!
Bryan


Here is a short clip (http://www.finelineclub.com/videos/Bryan_Tline_TNT_061806.wmv) of my first couple runs on Palmer with the Proto.
Please don't hold my performance against the board! :D
I guess it does serve a purpose of demonstrating the durability. :eek:

[Kirk]

Definitely looks like it works Bryan :biggthump

Thanks for sharing!



The fact that you were riding in mid-June...NO FAIR :mad: ;)

I need to plan a late spring/early summer trip to Hood

[Pow]

hmmm, looks like a great smooth ride :biggthump It seems it sacrifices a lot of skidability, but hey its a carving board.

[Ray]

My question is, how will the TNT Split perform under great conditions compared against other top of a line board... but I somehow have the feeling this thing really works.

Seems another exiting season is ahead of us with many news products available. Can’t wait for all the reviews.

Ray

[nekdut]

Bryan,

It looks like the TnT you have there does not have a Tinkler plate attached to it. Is it also compatible with the plate? Think about that combination: snow stix, TnT, split nose and tail....... :biggthump

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

Yes indeed! Very keen eye there! The Tinklers I have been riding this past season have (except for the Ryan M Board) all had either a Driver Plate with Snow-Stix or a Bindings Plate on them. This proto type felt very light and perhaps on the softer side of what I have been riding. My comment to Mike was " I can't wait to try one built with a Driver Plate and built for me!". Hint , hint. So to answer that very perseptive question, a hardy "YES SIR". That has , and is happening right now
I genuinely expected it to be another half season before these were made available to clients Mike has been so pleased with the design outcome that he offered the option to some of the most recent orders. I am hoping to hear back soon on the how the latest T n T Split System board is performing on snow. There is no doubt that Anton Poque will be putting it to the test in his legendary "no holes barred" spirit, zeal and energy. Another reason to excited about the rapidly approaching new season. :biggthump

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

My question is, how will the TNT Split perform under great conditions compared against other top of a line board... but I somehow have the feeling this thing really works.

Seems another exiting season is ahead of us with many news products available. Can’t wait for all the reviews.

Ray

The best way to answer that is to look at the personal results. I have been riding a good number of the top board brands available and I have been very pleased with their results. No question that the bar is being raised almost daily.
The question boils down to, what do I prefer to ride and what ends up in the truck on any given day? What was once my favorite board seldom gets to go out and play while the Tinklers are almost always what I am making turns on. (Unless it is a "Tanker Day") Like anything, you tend to use what works the best for you. Your favorite bike, skateboard, snowboard, whatever works for you.
FYI, yes, there will be some boards up for sale soon. Some of the locals have already claimed their favorites :eplus2:

[D-Sub]

What was once my favorite board seldom gets to go out and play while the Tinklers are almost always what I am making turns on.

does that mean we will be seeing some purple fingerprint boards on ebay soon? not likely!

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

does that mean we will be seeing some purple fingerprint boards on ebay soon? not likely!
Not likely, but if you do, it should be a red flag that I am in deep do-do.
That board will likely be in the quiver for years to come. I had hoped to bring John out of retirement to give those another run. We were very close, just didn't happen. You know me well Dave.

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

hmmm, looks like a great smooth ride :biggthump It seems it sacrifices a lot of skidability, but hey its a carving board.
Pow, depends allot on the specific board. Most of the boards I have had built for myself are not particularly good at skidding, although that can come in handy, I am willing to deal with that to ensure I have a knife edge that holds when it is important. Which is pretty much all the time ;) Another good observation though. Bryan


For fear of overstating the obvious: Tuning has a huge effect on this.

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

Definitely looks like it works Bryan :biggthump

Thanks for sharing!



The fact that you were riding in mid-June...NO FAIR :mad: ;)

I need to plan a late spring/early summer trip to Hood
My pleasure Kirk.

Absolutely! The time between the end of most ski areas season and the beginning of the summer "Camp" season is ideal. The most area available, cheaper lift tickets, no crowds and excellent snow conditions.
By this time of year it can be a bit of a "Zoo".

Happy to turn my back yard into a "Carvers Campground", keeping in mind I am an hour and half from Mt Hood. Plenty of cheap hotels in Portland and staying in the Hood River area has huge bonuses too.

[D-Sub]

Not likely, but if you do, it should be a red flag that I am in deep do-do.
That board will likely be in the quiver for years to come. I had hoped to bring John out of retirement to give those another run. We were very close, just didn't happen. You know me well Dave.

THAT board? dont you have like four of them?

sorry to hear about McGinnis...but isnt the Garage thing goin?

[nils]

I'd love to see a picture of that board in action !
Actually there was a Hot Prototype around 1992-1993 with a full split board carving. It was tested then by alexis parmentier of the hot pro team. I remember the picture showed the edge side was fully bent in the turn, while the other half was rather straight...strange...
The board halfes were only connected at the bindings.Forgot what the issues were then with that board, but it was abandoned. I'll try to dig the article+pic and scan it, or even contact alexis on the topic to have his memory review on it... one last thing is the board looked pretty dangerous for other slope users since the two edges at the tip are quite sharp and pointy ! If you hit someone while in a turn, it looks like a can opener almost !

Nils

[Fat Old Bastard]

Swingbo :lol:

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

Hi Nils, love to see the photos and article. Hot is/was a great board building company.
My experience is the flex is not so dramatic as to make the inside edges threatening. I may have additional video of the board being flexed that might help in demonstrating this. The corners are certainly not nearly as sharp as a Nitro Pow-Pow or any number of Swallowtails we all love ;) It actually forms almost a 90 degree angle at the split. Of course hitting someone with any snowboard is probably something we all want to avoid. Look forward to the info you mentioned.
Thanks, Bryan

[Ray]

The new boards do not have the extra inserts and flex shunts. This was a part of the testing phase. Providing adjustablility in an effort to pin point the "where" and "how much" factors.

I think it would be great to keep those extra inserts and flex shunts... maybe good to be able to adjust the flex for the split nose/tail, if desired.
Even if the board is build to riders specs I think it makes a great performance feature. Much easier to have the board build with it right from the beginning...
Let's see what the production split boards look like once they roll out.

Btw, can you actually have more than one driver plate (diff stiffness) with one board to change if wanted?

Thx
Ray

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

I think it would be great to keep those extra inserts and flex shunts... maybe good to be able to adjust the flex for the split nose/tail, if desired.

Btw, can you actually have more than one driver plate (diff stiffness) with one board to change if wanted?

Thx
Ray


Mike can build it anyway the client likes.
The impression I got from Mike is that he was REALLY happy the way the split nose and the driver plate / binding plate worked together.

To be clear. One driver plate on one board.

You bet. Templates of the driver/binding plates are kept on file. The plates are constructed much like a snowboard. They are designed to work with a specific board / rider however another can be made to replace the original.

Mike built plates for years prior to a time his clients finally talked him into building complete systems.

The variety of materials , shapes, flex is endless. Very nice feature of Duo Construction board systems.

[Ray]

Mike can build it anyway the client likes.
The beauty of custom work :biggthump


To be clear. One driver plate on one board.

The plates are constructed much like a snowboard. They are designed to work with a specific board / rider however another can be made to replace the original.


Sorry, must be my English :) I didn’t mean to have more than one driver plate on the board at the same time. I meant if an owner of a Tinkler could own more than one driver plate with a different stiffness, so these could be changed if different stiffness would be desired. Seems the driver plate is designed to go with the board, so that answers the question.

Thanks for your feedback Bryan!

Ray

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

Hi Ray, yes, I understood . I just put that in just in case my "Metric English" was lacking ;)

You could order additional plates that are stiffer, softer, different materials Etc. Mike could build a plate to fit any previously built board going back to even the MLY 183cm Race. However , in the case of the MLY , the plate would be more expensive than the board. You would have a killer set up. A Plate for my 183cm Race is one of the many things I would like to have Mike build for me. This was the first board designed from the factory to accept one of Mike's plates. (actually the black model made the year before) Before all the MLY Race owners write please understand the price is likely in the 3 to 500$ range. Thanks for the good questions Ray. Bryan

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

Silver on Silver 178cm TNT (http://www.finelineclub.com/pics/main.php?g2_itemId=4087) with Binding Plate, 17cm waist , someone is going to have an early Christmas.

[Scorpio]

What are the screw inserts for on the front split?

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

They provide additional options for flex adjustment.

Here are a few photos on a Tinkler TNT board

[Ray]

I really like the square nose design... maybe looks a little funny in real life and must see first, but again, always dig new ideas... well, not sure if some other board builder did this in the past, but have not seen it lately... so it's cool :biggthump

[www.oldsnowboards.com]

Pokkis has taken delivery on this jem. (http://www.oldsnowboards.com/pics/album83)

[Ray]

Bryan,

More specs please ;)

[pokkis]

178cm*19cm*13m :ices_ange

[Ray]

178cm*19cm*13m :ices_ange

Thanks Pokkis. How about nose and tail?

[pokkis]

Nose and tail width 24.5cm, center thickness 22 mm :rolleyes:

[Ray]

Nose and tail width 24.5cm, center thickness 22 mm :rolleyes:

Thanks!
Wow pokkis, you have two now!
Looking forward to hear your first impression report :biggthump

[pokkis]

Looks that i have almost everything as pairs :eek: hopefully i'm not turning to skier :nono: